Kintor Begins KX-826 Phase 3 Trial For Androgenic Alopecia
Pyrilutamide Phase 3 Results Shared: No Statistical Significance: Update (11/27/23)
After several years of promising and fast development, Kintor’s pyrilutamide appears to have come to a halt in its clinical development timeline. On November 27, 2023 Kintor Pharmaceutical announced that KX-826 aka pyrilutamide showed no statistical significance in target area hair count (TAHC) compared to the placebo group after 24 weeks of the trial. The consolation notes are that KX-826 did show an increase in non-vellus TAHC in its users compared to their starting hair counts, and that its overall safety was good with no serious adverse events reported. Kintor Pharmaceutical noted that it would continue to analyze the results and conduct further clinical trials of topical KX-826 in AGA and acne. Though, at this point, with a failed primary endpoint in a phase 3 trial, it does not seem likely that KX-826 will become an approved treatment for androgenic alopecia at the 0.5% concentration and twice daily application.
Kintor Begins Additional Long-Term Safety Study For Men And Women: Update (7/19/23)
Today’s update would have to deemed as unexpected to the majority of us following Kintor’s AGA drug development over the past 3 years. The company has announced an additional long term safety and efficacy phase 3 trial which will take place over the course of 52 weeks. This will likely affect the timeline for KX-826/pyrilutamide approval in China by over 1.5 years at minimum.
- Kintor’s additional phase 3 trial will enroll 270 male and female subjects, the first subject has been enrolled as of this week.
- The primary endpoint is the occurrence of treatment emergent adverse events. Secondary endpoint will be change in target area hair count compared to baseline.
The additional data from this trial may help KX-826 gain approval in other territories over the long term. However, for now, it appears that the imminent approval of pyrilutamide in China has been extended to a longer forecast.
Enrollment For Phase 3 Trial Has Completed in China: Update (3/28/23)
Just over a year since the initiation of the phase 3 clinical trial for KX-826 in China, Kintor Pharmaceutical announced the completion of enrollment of 740 male subjects in the phase 3 trial. This means that the necessary number of trial subjects have been entered into the trial, though some are still not done completing their dosing in the trial. In today’s release Kintor also mentioned an update on the US phase 2 trial of pyrilutamide/KX-826.
- The US phase 2 trial of KX-826 in male AGA completed enrollment in August 2022 and the company expects to release top line data in Q2 2023.
- Kintor Pharmaceutical plans to release top line data from its phase 3 trial in China in Q4 2023 and potentially follow with a new drug application.
Phase 3 Has Begun in China: Update (1/2/22)
On January 2, 2022, Kintor Pharmaceutical announced that the first male subject has received a dosing in their phase 3 pivotal trial of pyrilutamide. The phase 3 trial of pyrilutamide in male androgenetic alopecia will include:
- Randomized, double-blinded, placebo controlled parameters
- 416 male trial subjects
- A duration of 24 weeks/6 months
- A primary endpoint of change in number of non-vellus target area hair count from baseline to week 24
Kintor remains ambitious in this press release, which has become their M.O., and states that they intend to complete this trial by the end of 2022. Dr. Youzhi Tong, CEO of Kintor Pharma, had this to say: “We look forward to completing the planned 416 subjects enrollment by June 2022, and the follow-up medical evaluation（6 months study + 1 month follow-up）within the year. With the goal of completing the phase III clinical trial this year, we are speeding up the process and expecting that KX-826 would benefit global patients as soon as possible.“
While it is still slightly odd that the phase 3 trial has begun before the full phase 2 data was released to the public, the initiation of a phase 3 trial must be a good thing. We can be sure the phase 2 data will be released shortly.
Kintor Receives Clearance For Phase 3 in China: Update (11/24/21)
Just at the heading states, Kintor has officially received the “go ahead” to begin a phase 3 trial of pyrilutamide by the NMPA (equivalent to FDA) in China. The pivotal trial which could lead to market approval in China will comprise 416 male participants who will be studied over a 6 month time period. Full details on the announcement can be found on Kintor’s website.
In regards to the original premise of this article, that Kintor would begin a phase 3 trial in 2021, it appears that they are sticking to that timeline and are only off by a month or so. Let’s go Kintor.
Original Article
A recent presentation from the Chinese pharmaceutical company Kintor suggests a rapid development plan for its androgen receptor antagonist drug pyrilutamide.
Below is a slide from Kintor’s August 25th Interim Results Presentation which outlines the company’s program for pyrilutamide, a topical androgen receptor (AR) antagonist drug also known as KX-826.
https://en.kintor.com.cn/ – Click To Enlarge
As you can see, pyrilutamide is currently being trialed for the indications of androgenic alopecia as well as acne vulgaris. We’ve seen this pattern before with the AR antagonist drug clascoterone/Winlevi (aka Breezula in 7.5%) which has been approved by the FDA for the treatment of acne by the US FDA and is preparing to enter a phase 3 trial for male pattern hair loss. Most of the information on the slide above is typical market validation statistics that companies like to present to shareholders, however, one detail stands far out from the others. Between the two highlighted red arrows you’ll notice the statement “Conduct MRCT (multi-regional clinical trial) phase III clinical trials in China and US in 2021.” I believe this is the type of checklist item that my audience is looking for. It’s almost extraordinary that a company could conduct a phase 1b trial for a drug in one year and go into a phase 3 trial in the next year, but apparently Kintor has a strategy. Their plans are made clear on the presentation slide and as a publicly traded company their public communications are held to high standards. In a previous article, I’ve discussed one possibility of how Kintor could make the jump from phase 1 to phase 3 in the US so swiftly.
Kintor Pharmaceuticals Pyrtilutamide Pipeline October 2020 – Click To Enlarge
The above image of Kintor’s pipeline displays a phase 2 trial of pyrilutamide currently underway in China with a notation stating the trial is “expected to complete patient enrollment in 2020.” This would point to the trial being completed somewhere around the end of Q1 2021, perhaps in the month of April. Stay tuned. Also interesting, according to Kintor, data from the US phase 1b trial of pyrilutamide is to be released in Q4 2020. Lastly, females may want to keep an eye out for this drug, because even though it has not yet been indicated for female AGA, the drug is similar to clascoterone/Breezula which we know is being trialed specifically for female hair loss. Let’s hope for good things from Kintor over the next several months.
What do the readers think of this intriguing announcement from Kintor Pharmaceuticals? Comment below to share your feedback.
I hope everyone enjoys this good news from Kintor as we are looking at multiple new drugs becoming approved within the next few years.
Are we going to have the hair clone out in the next 7 or 10 years? I’m desperate and concerned !
My feelings Sarah, is that in Japan, it is more likely than not that there will be a a hair cloning treatment available within the next 7-10 years.
A Study Evaluating the Efficacy and Safety of SM04554 Topical Solution in Male Subjects With Androgenetic Alopecia. / Phase 3
Actual Study Start Date :
November 1, 2018
Estimated Primary Completion Date :
January 2021
Estimated Study Completion Date :
January 2021
In my opinion, this topical drug from Kintor will have limitations. If it is successful in trials, it will be akin to treating a knife or shotgun wound with sticking plaster. However, if Kintor’s drug is successful, I would like to buy some stocks so I can take afford hair cloning procedures (Tsuji, Stemson, Tissuse) assuming the aforementioned companies are successful in their trials!
Your statement is generally understood as a pretense by those of us that follow this news C. Pyrilutamide is a drug – like finasteride is – it’s not a hair transplant in a bottle.
I wouldn’t touch a hair loss company’s stock it will be a cheap penny stock pump and dump. Now if a big well known Pharma company comes out with a oral drug that regrows hair on a Norwood 7 then I would I would would take a starter ;). I would also invest in stemson therapeutics if they went public. But that’s about.
im saying it right here and now that we will have this before breezula, and I can’t wait. been waiting for breezula to move through clinical trials since 2014 and i’ve lost faith in their ability to do so.
it’s amazing with a company like this, or even histogen under its new management, and you see their drive to push through quickly and stick to deadlines
Looking forward to clascoterone or pyrtilutamide, whichever comes first! I thought Breezula was right on track, since it was always understood it would follow the acne medication, and Winlevi has been approved by the FDA as expected…?
Depending on (complete) side effect profile I expect this may be a safer and more cost effective option than breezula.
That would be a great outcome Baumer.
Why?
We need some pics before and after to judge and decide.we don’t know anything about the results.the question is this is more effective than minoxidil or not!!?
Afshin, of course we’re all interested in its efficacy. That will addressed in the data results from its current phase 2 trial in China and then the phase trials in China and US.
I have faith in Kintor. As soon as pyrilutamide is approved i will pull the trigger on a hair transplant.
I would like to get this drug synthesized as a «research chemical» but the chemical structure is nowhere to be found…
They have a compound labelled, “Example 12,” in a very lengthy patent filed in 2015 that I’ve been keeping my eye on. Of all structures, this is the only structure in their claim that they directly compare with RU58841 relating its superior hair growth effects in the patent conclusion. It is highly likely that this is the unnamed pyrilutamide. Yet we can’t know for certain.
What part of q4 2020 are we expecting preliminary results from the us?
Not sure, D1. Maybe early December?
The truth is we really only need a safe mainteneance treatment so that we can keep the hair we still have and then if you are not happy with what you have got you can always go for a trasplant. We don’t really need all of these cutting edge procedures we often talk about. Fingers crossed for this one boys, we deserve it 🙂
Shia you’re absolutely wrong. I’m a Norwood 5 at age 23 right now I’d like my hair back but I can’t get a transplant because it’s not advised and I’m destined for a Norwood 7. We need hair cloning to come out so I can get my hair back and Finasteride and these maintenance drugs don’t give me a full head of hair. I don’t want to keep spending money and taking a pill every single day of my life to just keep my hair! I need hair cloning! You’re probably a nw 2 that’s not thinking about the rest of us.
Exactly Woofy 🙂 but unfortunately none of these hair cloning company starts human trials, and I thinik this is not happen this year, imo hair cloning is at least ten years away, the progress i veeeeeeeeeeery slow
Jan I know I’ve heard your opinion on hair cloning many times. But that’s why I’m going to join the trial.
Woofy 2030 is great date, 10 years is not long, at least for me, i can wait, but i would be verry happy if i am wrong about the timeline
I think you have the right attitude – taking pills for years at such a young age, it‘s just irresponsible.
You are 23, you have a great chance to have full hair at 30. Believe me, at 30 you are still a very young lad with lots of good years ahead.
^ Ben is spot on with that comment.
Hate to disagree, “taking pills” ,aka finasteride, in your 20’s is not irresponsible for most and will likely save your hair. Without it you might as well be Don Quixote chasing windmills waiting for stem cell treatments. They will come someday, you don’t know when and you’ll be bald in the meantime.
We do need a cure for this shit !!!
Don’t normally message on here. But wanted to reply and say thank you Shia for that positive message. It really lifted my spirits after reading for months about all the doom and gloom of the hair loss industry and its lack of new solutions, whilst watching clump after clump of hair fall.
Thanks for the kind words man, it makes my day knowing I brought some positivity in someone else’s life. I know somedays it gets harder but we will get through.
@woofy what part of mainteneance treatment you don’t understand? The kind of thing that would prevent you from losing any more ground, so you would never reach the norwood 7 type of pattern. Norwood 5 can be recovered with a good surgeon, that’s why I said we just need a safe and effective mainteneance drug
Listen Shia I’m fine with Finasteride, I’m very happy it has stopped my hair loss but drugs don’t last forever and fin doesn’t work for everyone and I’m sure this topical won’t work for everyone and results will be similar to fin. When you say maintenance I’m thinking a drug that you have to keep taking that doesn’t fix the whole problem! It’s very simple shia! And I think it’s extremely odd that you don’t want something like hair cloning you just want a maintenance TREATMENT drug.
Pff i used to take finasteride but then i stopped and my hair started falling again, i already have very reduced volume of hair and i’m only 20. 🙁
Not a fan of topical Treatments they never really give good results and it’s a pain to keep doing over and over again. You need oral.
I’ll tell my hair that Woofy! 😉 Maybe not for you but that doesn’t mean everyone.
Woofy, you are very self centred. Nobody dislikes hair cloning. Why should they?
But for others, topicals might not be hazzle and they may work. Just think about combo minox and AB-103 in the near future.
There are many readers here that may benefit from current treatments or ones that are about to be released.
If they read your comments, they may follow your ideas and not starting treatments right now because they wait for some treatment that may never make it to the market. Dont forget this
BTW, opinions are never right or wrong.
MRKA self centered? That’s funny ? you do know that Finasteride is a oral treatment and in studies SOME men continued to lose hair but like 90% had stopped there hair loss and they see regrowth and this continued after 5 years something like that. I’m just saying this topical drug will not work for SOME men and I’m also saying that I’m not a fan of topicals it’s just a hassle. That’s my opinion I don’t really want people who read this stuff to take SOME of the stuff i say on here seriously they have a brain they can think independently and talk to a doctor.
Woofy, just relax.
Balding started at the age of 14. Fortunately not agressive. I am almost as old as Yoda. I used minox 30 years ago. From memory I am a non responder. I used Propecia for many years. Now I am on Avodart. Prescribed by my urologist for BHP. I microneedle and use NGF-574H what is more or less useless for me.
So I wait for AB103, being probably a non responder its something to be excited about.
So please clearly indicate your statements as opinions and not as facts. It definitely does influence peoples decisions.
Hairloss is an extremly emotionally subject. Therefore people make emotional decisions and often do not use their rational mind. Emotions can overpower rational thought. Ask a psychologist.
All readers should use discernment and not make decisions solely off of what they read in the comments…
Hi admin I saw this article on website 2020 , https://28thannual.org/, perhaps interesting for you and your viewers?
Hi thanks for sharing Pjotre. I will keep an eye on this, hopefully some worthwhile info comes from it.
Follicle thought and yoda you’re guys thoughts please. So I watched the ISHRS video interview with Alexey Terskikh And the interviewer Dr Bradley Wolf and Dr Wolf says to Alexey at 18:29 “so you’re not going to put us hair movers or hair transplanters out of business for a while we will keep moving the intact follicles” And Alexey responded well to that, but I don’t know if this if this Dr Bradley wolf was joking or not but this kind of pissed me off. It’s about what’s best for the patients not so you can keep making big bucks with your transplants.
I’m not quite sure what your issue is with that statement Woofy, it sounded like a comment made in jest.
follicle thought, Well i hope so. But one of my concerns and i’ve had this concern for a long time, is that hair transplant surgeons, do not want hair cloning to come out because it will basically put them out of business. And they love treatments just look at Dr Mgrath in one video he said “hair cloning will probably never come out in our life time”. And then you see him working with a company on exosome injections to try and treat AGA. So i don’t know i just find it suspicious.
Woofy, I’ll just say I don’t agree that there is something to be concerned about regarding hair transplant surgeons. It’s possible some of them doubt hair cloning, but they really don’t have any power to stop or prevent hair cloning from coming, they’re just surgeons running their offices. There’s no way to explain how a surgeon correlates to an established company with funding who is running clinical trials.
No insult, but your opinion is just wrong and against all market mechanisms.
If StemsonTx is safe, effective AND easy to implement for a surgeon, it will hit the industry like a tsunami and normal transplants will just vanish within a couple of years. Patients will only accept the new method as it is far superior: no extraction and unlimited follicles.
Initially it will be more expensive than a standard transplant and hence there will be a coexistence of both methods, but eventually the price will drop and then it‘s „game over“.
I also think that with new instruments (as Terskikh said, automation) the procedure will be done much quicker than a FUE – I assume they will have a device which will shoot the scaffolds into the skin, like a pistol and a barrel.
On the other side there‘s more work in the background: extraction of the cells, delivery, cultivation/amplification, delivery,…
And just to add: as there are a lot of hair transplant surgeons worldwide, the know-how (aesthetics, safety) to do such a procedure is already there, and there won‘t be limited access.
And i should mention not all hair transplant surgeons
I agree with woofy that hair transplant doctors dont want cloning to come out. I am sure the iashrs has a pretty good pull lobbying and blocking such advanced treatments. However, you would think the top big players would adopt hair cloning into their practice to make more money. It will take years for hair cloning doctors to build out labs, hair cloning clinics globally. They could license out the hair cloning to ht docs and build a business model that way. Quicker and more of global reach to everyone. Woofy dont listen to McGrath he looks like a used car salesman trying ti sucker you in for that extended warranty. He works on exosones because his transplants suck and needs another snake oil money maker. I hope cloning comes out quick and destroys these shady ht docs that take our money and ruin our hair.
“The IAHRS has a pretty good pull lobbying and blocking such advanced treatments” ? I’m sorry to say Mjones, that statement is completely unfounded, it’s also a bit nonsensical.
Mjones there’s another hair transplant doctor by the name of Dr Craig Ziering I’ve seen him on TV promoting viviscal like it’s the holy grail
Hi Admin,
Think we will get a product from Applied Biology by this year?
Hi Taylor, I think so. I will be posting an update on the product release by the end of October.
Hey admin yeah you are right…I went off on a rant there lol but I am sure there are some big players in the ht game that are trying hard to block better options that ht. In the long term they wont be successful since hair cloning will prevail but we will have to fight for it to come sooner.
Yoda is too tired to read all the comments in detail. I guess my bottom line is that while I don’t think there is an all powerful cabal of Hair Transplant docs that could thwart a new treatment from coming out they probably wouldn’t be pleased with any disruption to their cash cow. Many (in my opinion the majority) care more about the $$$ than anything else. Be particularly leery of Docs that push alternative treatments (one just posted on this site fairly recently selling “at home PRP, laser, etc.) like Mjones noted. It’s marketing BS to accomplish three things: 1. Separate you from your money 2. Lure you in and eventually upsell you to a transplant. 3. Very little to affect your hair. Like the saying goes, in for a penny, in for a pound.
Sonic, fyi, Follicle Thought is not very interested in the conspiracy theories.
In my opinion one can say that there is no interest in finding a “once and for all” solution to this problem, meaning that companies might not have an economic interest in spending time and resources looking for a cure. Another thing is to say that “big pharma” and the “hair trasplant doctors’ lobby” are working in the shadow so that the the cure will never be found, this is simply ridiculous in my opinion, and if this is what you really think why would you even bother visiting a blog like this? You simply can’t stop the progress, and the day we will have the scientific knowledge and the know – how to translate it into a clinical procedure there will be no existing force that can prevent it from being commercialized.
Sorry for mentioning you Follicle Thought.
@Shia, I can understand from the perspective that you have of assuming nobility and integrity amongst the big pharma such as manufacturers of Propecia/Finasteride and Minoxidil, DUT and others. But even Yoda said, he’s sure they wouldn’t be happy about new products coming out which would reduce their profits and possibly eventually eliminate them completely from the market. So why wouldn’t it be hard to believe they’d try to block or at least slow down the progress of new treatment?
Wise man Yoda also mentioned these people in the pharmaceutical companies and Hair Transplant Surgeon and any other people mainly making money off the hair loss industry are mainly more concerned about the $$$. He is completely right about that because how many do we know that would gladly sell you snake oil treatments when they know full well there isn’t any cure. It’s all about the money they can make.
Furthermore, what is so “ridiculous” about this corruption in the hairloss industry??? There is corruption in every industry. Education, politics, logistics, police (the very people sworn to protect us), etc. Look at any government of any country, it should be “ridiculous” for them to be corrupt but it they are all corrupt. If you’re telling me you don’t know of any stories where bribery happens such as people being paid to keep quiet or slow progress of something, you need to watch a lot more news and read a lot more of the newspaper.
The reason I’m here is because I’m part of the hair loss community, contributing and looking for solutions. I believe in the possibility of progress and a cure but to do that we cannot pretend like politics and corruption/bribery doesn’t happen. We have to acknowledge that it is a possibility and look for solutions of how we can still go around it.
@Shia I think you misunderstood what I was saying. Trust me, I don’t doubt any company in the pipeline from trying to be a genuine treatment or cure, at all. What I’m saying is, I have suspicions regarding mainly the regulatory boards that these companies have to go through in order for them to be deemed effective/safe, such as the FDA and their equivalents in other respective countries.
Yes i know we’re still a few years off from having the technology to have an actual cure. But like I said, if you look at the TissUse Thread, in the comments you’ll find that the company has their product/procedure ready for trial. They even have the funding to pay for the trial. But they can’t find a single Cellular Processing Company (CPC) that will do their trial for almost an entire year. I mean really?! It’s even in the comments in the thread there where it says that the CPC’s don’t want to conduct TissUse trial because it will be supporting a competitor of the already bigger names in the market.
So yeah… In that instance I acknowledged the “possibility” of corruption but I suggested a pro-active solution that should work around the “possible” issue so that progress doesn’t get slowed down regardless
If it’s all about the money then just try to imagine what’s in there for the guys that find the “cure”. Can you imagine a company sitting on a technology that could make em earn billions just because merk wants to keep selling finasteride? Come on man.
Truth is we are not even close to where we would like to be in understanding the biology of our bodies, and I had the proof of this on myself, I had a thyroid autoimmune disease and doctors literally have no way to treat it other than just remove the thyroid.
Ok guys, the discussion around potential conspiracy theories in the industry has come to close. This site has no interest in giving rise to such concepts. It’s really an outdated theory to be honest, with so many companies now on the verge of clinical trials so long as they can get their technology right. On to the next subject please.
Thanks for that Admin, I think Sonic is misconstruing Yoda’s words. Please re-read what I said.
Well said sonic! Admin he is 10000% correct. But yes I agree we should stop talking about conspiracy theories because it always leads to arguments. We all have our own views on it and we should respect each others opinions. Anywho….who else is going to buy some histogen stock?
Mjones I might buy.
Cool woofy! Hopefully they succeed with good results so we can make a quick couple grand. Pay for our rogaine and propecia for the year lol
Mjones lol.
Ffs. Guys. Just some basic economic thinking. I know, that hair transplant industry is making fine money, but can you imagine the price of a good treatment or a cure? Any hair transplant surgeon would immiediately start selling the cure if he had a chance. Even pharma companies. Only reason you do not see that much of interest in hair loss from big pharmas is, that the risk of wasting money is too high. Skin is like an organ and making organ regrow or repair part of it is really hard for medicine. You can’t do it with just some pill. My knowledge from my father who is business manager for one big pharma company is, that most wanted are treatments or cures for things, that are usually covered by health insurance. Hair loss is not and probably never will be under coverage. + Hair loss research is expensive with unpredictable results.
Please stop bullshiting yourself with these nonsense and just accept, that we still knows close to nothing about hair loss and our only hope is to wait and see if Follicum, Samumed etc. will manage to find something valuable.
Yoda’s hope is that hair transplant surgeons wouldn’t be needed in the next generations of treatments and they would land with doctors that have a higher degree of ethics as a group.
mjones i would also buy stemsontx stock if it was public in heart beat.
and just hold for a long time
What do you guys think about TissUse? It’s been almost 1 year and they can’t find a Cell Processing Company (CPC) to do their trial. It’s the only thing holding them back.
Could we get some of our hairloss community here to brainstorm how we can help them find a solution to this problem?
Don’t we have some people from Japan here? I know YoungJet is from Japan and attended Tsuji’s latest conference on the 25th August and that he’s very interested in the Hairloss Industry.
Follicle Thought, Could we possibly ask our members/contacts in Japan if they could do a little homework/research assignment for us to scout for CPC’s in Japan for TissUse? I would think they’d be our best alternative bet to finding CPC’s in Japan and if they find some, we could recommend them to TissUse and solve their problem. The more people we have working on this, the quicker we can find the solution.
We need to look at it as their problem is also our own problem.
We need to think of the treatments in the pipeline as our kids – so we need to support them as best we can and we want them to go through all the trials (which can be compared to school/university for our kids) as quickly as possible because we want our the treatments to come to fruition (our kids to graduate).
Hairloss community, let’s pull together and try to use our resources and friends/family/contacts who are in Japan (if you have any) to scout for CPC’s for TissUse. We can do this guys.
Hey Sonic, I appreciate your proactiveness and willingness to help find a solution for J Hewitt and yourself. It’s a great initiative and a great mindset. In this case however, based on my knowledge of the situation it would be very unlikely that anyone here would be able to find a CPC that is not already on the radar of J Hewitt. In this case, I think the best option is just to wait and keep the positive thoughts up.
@FollicleThought
In regards to the treatments that are due to be released within the next 6 months i.e AB103, TH16 or WAY cosmetic, which of these do you believe holds the most promise for regrowing hair?
Minoxidil and Finasteride! 😉
Well Nick, I would say first off the WAY cosmetic has been released and there are members of this audience who are already using the product and preparing to give feedback. AB103 is a shampoo set to enhance minoxidil for non-responders and likely to increase minox response in responders. So, I guess it will be between WAY and TH16, let’s see how it goes.
@FollicleThought do you have a link to the WAY product online? Also I thought they were meant to release clinical data on this?
any news on that way analogue ? btw I just replicated th16 by using the same product on the patent ( melatonin and resveratrol) will keep you uptaded
Yoda, for Some people Finasteride has way too many bad side effects and for some people Finasteride doesn’t work at all. For me personally, Finasteride just made things worse so I stopped after a year.
Minoxidil has minor results at best and negligible results for the rest of the people.
I suppose that’s why Nick123 and others like myself are suggesting other options besides Finasteride and Minoxidil
Relax Sonic, it was tongue in cheek remark, although I believe fin and min will ultimately be more effective for the majority than the two treatments mentioned. My opinion, not a fact.
Yeah I wish minoxidil worked for me but I believe I’m a non-responder. Tried it for over a year, no shedding, no regrowth, just an itchy scalp. I’m hoping Applied Biology’s AB-103 + Microneedling will help me respond to minoxidil.
Hey Louis, you can follow some audience members who are using the WAY analog and reporting their observations in the WAY article.
Ah. Haha, it’s all good Yoda ?
LG MediHair will launch this Month …
http://www.koreaherald.com/view.php?ud=20201012000290
Oh great, another laser helmet! 😉
🙂 yeah! Its end of 2020 and I will put it next to minox …. Wait, what!?
Minox has help save my hair for over 40 years JD, along with fin/dut both oral and now topical Yoda has a decent head of hair. So a different category in my opinion. Oh, and lasers work, so does PRP, etc. just for a very few with minimal results with the exception of some outliers. And usually it’s the best case scenarios that these companies and docs like to highlight.
In that case, Yoda, I wouldn’t be wasting my money on the LG laser, thanks for the heads up. Whilst we’re talking about all different options. What are you guys thoughts on DHT blocking shampoos? Do they work?
Personally, I don’t believe they do work because if they did, almost everyone would be using it and we’d see far less people dealing with hair loss. Plus if it did work, they’d be scientific results published about it
In that case Yoda, I won’t go and waste my money by buying the LG laser, thanks for the heads up regarding laser treatment having only minimal results at best – for the very few that do respond (as I expected though).
Whilst we’re talking about all different options. What are you guys thoughts on DHT blocking shampoos? Do they work?
Personally, I don’t believe they do work because if they did, almost everyone would be using it and we’d see far less people dealing with hair loss. Plus if it did work, they’d be scientific results published about it
Sonic, you’ve answered your own question. You are wise, but not as wise as the Yoda! 😉
LG claiming
According to the clinical results conducted by LG Electronics at Seoul National University Bundang Hospital for 46 adult men and women, the hair of participants who used LG Prael Medi Hair in 27-minute mode three times a week for a total of 16 weeks is 1 square centimeter compared to before use. The density per (cm 2) increased by 21.64%. The thickness of the hair was also increased by 19.46%.
I definitely try if can buy this in uk
Hi Kapil, sounds not that bad. Do you have a link?
It’s in Korean
https://live.lge.co.kr/lg-pral-event/
Feel free to give it a shot if you’d like to Kapil. I don’t have much expectations for the product at the moment. If you do try, please report anything in the comments.
FT, did you hear that Shiseido started enrolling patients for its second 12 month trial of Replicel’s RCH-01 treatment?
https://www.facebook.com/177949328930574/posts/3438484549543686/?extid=0&d=n
If I am not in error, did RCH-01 not prove itself to be an utter disaster? If so, what sense does it make to conduct another trial? 2+2 does not equal 5 no matter how many times one tries…lol!
They are doing multiple rounds of injections now
RCH-01 really hasn’t proven anything, that’s the point of clinical trials, which it’s still in. The only ones who seem to know the outcome with certainty already are various “Bro-Scientists” on the internet.
You can try writing a letter to Shiseido headquarters, if you’d like to inform them, C.
Wow, that’s some unexpected (but nevertheless great) news, Twenti!
If Shiseido does the Tiral alone on Japan without Replicel it does not mean anything for the rest of the world i guess because they only have the license for Japan. ???
Another wise one that has answered his own question. However Shiseido’s license is for all of Asia as Yoda remembers.
RCH-01 is a joke the results are terrible and I’m sure if you increase doses the results will still be terrible. If it’s not a jaw dropping dramatically positive result then it’s not worth thinking about. RCH-01 and replicel are dead to me. And no I’m not Mr Wonderful lol 😉
So Woofy, if this trial brings some relevant results, say, on par with Follica’s one released photograph, are you pledging that you’d never get the treatment done?
Hi follicle thought, Yes I’m pledging that I will never get RCH-01 treatment done even if it looks like a Follica result. And I wouldn’t do hairclone the British company injections. I’m not a fan of injections the only injection I would do, is Histogen’s injection’s because I’m impressed with there results.
Cool
“Cool” must be the new “that makes no freakin sense Woofy”! 😉
Tbh I don’t disagree with the Replicel haters here. Over the past 10yrs they have only overpromised and under-delivered, but let’s give them another year to see how the trials turns out.
Right, only a year. There are so many treatments that will be out in a year that if it takes longer we can tell them to go to hell! That was sarcasm in case you couldn’t tell.
My last comment about replicel lol. This is what they posted in 2012 on there youtube channel https://youtu.be/cCe5mg7X6zg trying to hype RCH-01. The only way you will get that kind of result like that lucky animated person lol is with stemson or tsuji with the actual cloning and follicle transplantation.
You’re right @WOOFY. I also came across that animation video back in 2015, when my hair loss journey began, and till today they’ve only been going around in circles. I’m highly pessimistic of Replicel too but you shouldn’t put Hairclone in the same boat as them. Hairclone will likely be a industry leader in hair follicle regeneration and they’re well funded by the UK gov, and begin their follicle banking service in 2021.They’ve also got a great team with a variety of skills, contacts and knowledge.
Twenty, 2015 is when my hair loss journey begin also it started in November. As for hairclone the only thing I like about hairclone is there follicle banking, I think the u.s. should have that.
“stemson or tsuji” really? They haven’t conducted clinical trials on humans yet, unless you know something that the rest of the free world doesn’t. I’ll never get hair treatment “fan boys” for treatments that are pre clinical trial or in the midst. Woofy, you must have a stiffy for Dr. Tsuji.
Let’s dial it back a little there Yodes.
That was dialed back Admin…you should witness Yoda unleased! 😉
yoda, “woofy you must have a stiffy for Dr tsuji” ? you put a smile on my face with that one yoda hahaha. But seariusly Dr Tsuji or Stemson in my veiw have far more potential then all the other companies, its a next gen hair tranplant, potential to give someone a full head of hair. I would try histogen, follica, and the treatment Dr Rassman is working on, (when they come out) but in the end all roads lead back to one and that is hair follicle cloning.
So true Woofy:)
Glad you get me Woofy…Yoda was just being a pompous ass! 😉
Yoda if not Tsuji or Stemson then who in Your opinion?
Anything in clinical trials on humans, especially phase III. Hard for me to get excited about theories, mice or invitro.
I think we should wait the second trial and the multi injections procedure’s result, then you have the permission to be unimpressed, mad or you chose the word. Personally for me the more things going on the better for us all. Also in this field, mind I’m not a scientist, I have the feeling that even the smallest detail can make a difference between dramatic or disappointing results, so what if they found out that a small change in cells concentrarion is much more effective? They know better than us if this holds promise or they wouldn’t bother with a second trial.
I would also suggest that in the current global pandemic shiseido wouldn’t spend the money on further trials unless they thought it was worth it, plus i think they are keeping their cards very close to their chests because of the relationship breakdown with replicel.
You know it’s going to be very interesting seeing hair cloning transplant go through the clinical trial stages since it’s basically a hair transplant that we already have, it’s not a drug so all they have to do is transplant the hairs monitor and wait a year for full hair growth right? And then I wonder what will be different in the other trials just more participants and continued monitoring?
surprised to see some say they dont like the idea of injections. to me this is the ideal hair loss treatment. rather than a daily topical or surgery, you just pop in for 10 minutes every 3- 6 months and let the chemicals work their magic. it would be my ideal method of treatment
I know what you mean Steve.
They are holding out for the “holy grail” and write off incrementalism or anything that is taking longer than the company 1st indicated. Logic, or lack thereof…one of Yoda’s greatest hits “if it were that easy everyone would be doing it”!
I’m with you Steve, injections are less invasive than an hair trasplant and would not require the level of dedication and committment a solution to apply everyday take.
Woofy I think you are just giving too many things for granted about hair cloning. The day the first trial start it will still not be a question of when but still a question IF it works, there are too many varibles and the researchers might run into new problems when translating all of the theoretical biology into the human scalp ( quality of hair, hair cycles, resistance to dht, lifelong hair or not? ecc ). let’s stay positive but assumptions are dangerous in this field.
Shia didit Tsuji solve all these problems that You wrote in Your post?
He might have solved them theoretically, of which I’m not sure tho, but my point is that clinical trials, if they ever happen, are not gonna be a pure formality.
Shia only time will tell, it may be 5 or 50 years, who knows, or maybe never
Hi FT, on replicel website they posted that shiseido started the multiple injection trial.might be interesting for the cpmmunity
https://www.lgpralevent.co.kr/m/
Hey Admin. You know how Histogen’s results look really great in the pictures. Did they ever publish data where they specified how much regrowth per squared centimetre on the scalp occurred? Like I mean in actual figures? Or is that what their currently ongoing trial will determine?
Hey JayJames, histogen did post regrowth stats from their phase 1 and phase 2 trials. I csnt remember the exact amount but it was solid regrowth and thickening. I was bummed it never got released in 2015 as they estimated. I am sure with their new ceo they will release a treatment in the next few years. I am sure you can find their phase 1/2 results from early 2010s.
Ahhh ok I’ll have a look! Thanks Mj ?
Can anyone jog my memory to why Histogen failed the first time round in their Phase 3 trials? Was it efficacy or safety? I can’t seem to find much info on google.
Histogen never did a phase 3 trial before Nick213. They came close to doing a phase 3 in Mexico but I guess the planned partner was bought out by another company before things could get going.
So what was the reason for them starting from scratch again? Could they not have just partnered with another company and continued the phase 3?
They had to go back to phase 1b for US FDA Nick, the phase 3 was for Mexico with a different regulatory committee. Apparently, they could not find another partner in Mexico.
JayJames, this is from 2012 https://www.fiercebiotech.com/biotech/histogen-announces-initial-results-from-phase-i-ii-clinical-trial-of-hsc
Thanks a lot Woofy! Looks pretty impressive ?
JayJames no problem, Oh and remember Histogen said they improved the hair growth serum that was way after that 2012 trial so I’m very excited to see what tweaking the serum has done.
Woofy, I thought you were against injections? You change your mind more often than Yoda changes his under ware!
Yoda, well I’m not a fan of injections but right now as I see it, Histogen is the top performing injection company with very good results. And I’m not a fan of injections because they hurt like hell haha and you know the results from injections are not very good the only way I will give another injection company a chance is if I see dramatic results, and like I said if RCH-01 gets the same result as Follica it’s not worth it in my opinion I’d rather do Follica’s device plus RCH-01 is all the way in Japan I don’t want to go all the way over to Japan for that result.
Histogen would be great, it looks promising. We really need new growth stimulants. I’m 15 years into fighting hair loss, and finasteride has very successfully maintained my hair. My hairline/temple region bothers me though.
Once upon a time, minoxidil really worked for me – then I developed a skin allergy.
I’ve tried oral minox but I’ve given up on that. Possibly would have helped but I wasn’t prepared to take more than a couple of mg and even that freaked me out. Also kept checking my heart rate all the time and was worried about water retention etc; didn’t seem worth it.
Not sure how i can improve my situation and stop thinking about this problem. Ideally a better minoxidil will arrive in the next couple of years, but im doubtful Perhaps I should just save for a transplant. Not sure about the downtime or where the finds are coming from though.
Woody, isn’t follicas method utilizing thousands upon thousands of tiny needle punctures? Repeatedly until your head is raw? Or is it the actual injection of a substance you’re opposed to?
Woofy*
Oceanvibe, it’s the substance I don’t like RCH-01 substance they have proven it doesn’t have much effectiveness, injections hurt, and I’m not traveling all the way to japan for such a little result no thanks. Think of Follica as your device for starting a fire you need to create a spark well once you create that little spark (of hair) then you use the Fuel ⛽️ and you know what that fuel is? Histogen. But like I’ve said many times here in the end these are just treatments all roads will lead back to one and well you know what that is HC. 🙂
Woofy, I didn’t know you could see into the future. You seem to already know the outcomes of treatments that are still in clinical trials. Can you pick some stocks for me and tell me what age I’ll be going to the great beyond? That way I’ll get rich and be able to spend it right up to the moment of the inevitable! 😉
Yoda, I don’t even have a response lol ? I give up.
You’re a good kid woofy…and smart not to mess with the Yoda! 🙂
I would def pick an injection treatment once every 3 months then do rogaine nightly and dermaroll all the time. If it’s like botox where you go in dr office get a series of injections and then carry on with your life without applying daily topicals, then histogen is a no brainers. Simplicity is key. But if a wounding like follica with daily topical grows a ton of hair I would obviously do that too. However it would be nice to do just injections 4x a year and get rid of the daily hassle of applying minox and deal with that all the time. Let’s see how these phase 1 results turn out. I’m hoping for solid regrowth.
Histogen sounds good. You would get your hair cut more often than have their injections.
I also agree, injections are the ideal treatment. Walk in, walk out and come back a few months later instead of daily topicals which can sometimes be exhausting.
For me in follicle thoughts ultimate guide to hair regeneration, Histogen holds the most promise!
I’m really contemplating about investing in Histogen, a quick share price check on google shows just few years ago their share price was $50-80 but now they’ve restarted their clinical trials their share price is around $2.
With the upcoming clinical trial results in December it seems like a no brainer to invest in Histogen to me.
how many hairs per cm2 you should have to have dense hair?
Jan, I think like 200 or 300 cm2 but hair Transplant surgeons can create the illusion of full density with I think they use 100cm2 (not sure) Then they use lateral slit technique. There is another technique but lateral slit technique is the better one.
Around 45-50 follicles per cm2 will produce a good dense head of hair look. That is typical for most upper tier surgeons.
Nick you should buy some stock of histogen. It went up to 2.36 per share on Ftiday but it fell back down to 2.12 today at close. Last Monday it was at 1.85. If phase 1 performs well this stock will shoot up. Just drop 2 to 3k and watch it.
Mjones I’ve been watching it, maybe I’ll use some of my options profits to buy Histogen I keep you posted.
It was 50 to 80 due to a reverse split
i have one simple question, as i am not good at english, because it is not my first language, stemson will start their human trials in 3-4 years or 3-4 for comercialization?
This is not clear at the moment Jan, even Alexey Terskikh will not elaborate on it. Commercialization is not possible in 3-4 years so it will likely be 2-3 years for trials to start.
They haven’t even started human trials so how can one possibly know when it will be commercialized? I read somewhere they might start trials in 2021, fingers crossed
Shia i thought they start clinical trials in 3-4 years, that worte me people from hlt forum, i do not know english so i am not sure
Well Terskikh said in 2018 that it won’t be availvable before 8-10 years so I guess all we can do is wait, but I am confident stemson will deliver
Hi Admin,
Can you please explain me why everyone is critisising RCH-1 results so much? Didnt they have regrowt and stoped balding at the 9 month mark according to the diagramm they showed in the study?
The results were so little and it did not stop balding. I think the user jake+Palmer on the other site not sure if he’s on this site also? had a good reason to why RCH-01 is not the way to approach AGA.
Yeah, you should believe whatever some random guy on the internet says, especially if they aren’t associated with the company. Come on Woofy!
In the first study, the results were not great, but it was only from one set of injections. Shiseido is hoping now that multiple injections will work better.
Organ technologies website has been down for maintenance for the past few days, seems strange that a website has to be taken offline for such work in 2020. Wonder are we getting an update soon and that’s the reason for the maintenace or is the website being taken down.
I think with 100% certainty that it’s a sign that Tsuji has failed.
Not really, I wanted to get into the speculation game and watch peoples heads explode with a baseless claim! 🙂 No one knows what the situation is except possibly Organ’s IT department.
You read hair loss talk forum too?:D
In my humble opinion. a few people think my claims are baseless. Now 5 months ago I claimed the hardest part of this was getting the hair to form the right curl pattern. If you look at this article a senior medical researcher states the same thing. We’re close but the main issue now is having hair follicles form that “tear drop shape”. 4 years ago when they’d clone follicles and inject them back into the scalp, the follicles would die after a couple months because the structure of the follicle was weak. In 2018 Tsuji pioneered a collagen gel that lets follicles hold their shape because of the reduction in friction. Stemson recently raised a ton of funding to perfect the shape of follicles. Even a micrometer in differentiation in width of the follicle can make the hairs look fake. Thats why I said its fairly easy to clone follicles but its hard cloning follicles that produce hair in the same curl pattern.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2019/07/hair-for-all/594826/
As for a cure. I think they’ll launch a human trial within 2020, march 2021 at the latest, but I caution, am I skeptical that they produce identical hair to the one you have, yes. Most of you are concerned about a release which is wrong, you should be concerned more about whether the hair looks realistic. Though I will say this, Tsuji never picked hair follicles because he wanted to cure baldness, he did it because its the easiest organ to clone first. Hair doesn’t have a function other than to thermoregulate your skin, but he chose to use the technology to fix hair first then work on cloning teeth then liver than lungs.
Hmmm, did I say “your” claims are baseless Jakester? Two separate posts from Yoda, they were addressing different topics. Unless you were projecting, no harm no foul.
Jake so we can have thicker hair than the original ones with Tsuji method?
No if you change the genetic makeup of your hair not only will it look fake but theres certainly going to be a possibility of a cancerous mutation. What I was trying to say was, back in 2016 when they had this problem when they’d go and clone the follicle, the follicles would be crooked and not “perfect”. The hair would look like corkscrews because all hair is, is your follicle compressing certain through a follicle shaft into a strand. Its dead cells. The hairs would be thicker and thinner at certain points because of the follicle deforming and spreading out. it would eventually die out. Now you can change the color of your hair back to your original color from gray to black etc by adding keratin cells but that’s as far as it goes.
Jake do you think it can be used to clone the hair from the beard?
of course, it could even clone eyebrow hair. Theres tons of females out there with eyebrow hair loss. I think the eyebrow cloning industry will be bigger because eyebrows frame the face. now whether you’d want a beard transplant that’s another question
yoda isn’t messing around when he pulls out his lightsaber lol 😉
Reading this conversation, if Yoda had a lightsaber he’d use it on himself!
ok Jake but can they use hair from beard to restore hair on head?
do I think baldness will be cured during the decade, absolutely 1000% because most of the cell cloning issues where resolved by other scientists at Riken. They trialed this for other procedures starting all the way back in 2014. The only thing that left is getting the follicle to produce an identical hair, because even the slightest manipulation can cause shitty hairs to sprout. its like getting a hair transplant and having some hairs be wispy. Its because the doctor cut the follicle wrong. same goes here. do I think this will be expensive for a very long time. Of Course. 1 million people paying 200,000 is 200 billion dollars. And to scale a bioengineering plant to a million people is a challenge in it of itself. And tbh I dont think Stemson will come in cheaper if they clone it. Its kind of like insulin. If everybody knows theres a market they’ll just stay at that price.
Jake imo 200k$ for a head full of hair is not much
200k for hair is not expensive. it should cost a million to be honest. I can tell you now, the cloning plant build is going to cost at least 15 billion. from personal experience, a cell aeration station can cost 250,000 alone and that deals with 1 patient and is one moving part of the puzzle. I imagine the price to decrease to the mid 60’s by late 2030 early 2040 but its a supply and demand thing. Think of it like diamonds. Diamonds are artificially priced, But the reason their so expensive is because all the miners aren’t willing to sell for less. I think the same will go for this. Given organ technologies has global patents. Them and stemson wouldn’t have global competition for the next decade essentially. and when your the company that performed millions of procedures with proven results, why would you trust some random copycat for 50k less in 2030. Thats the mindset of the medical community.
Jake that is true!if someone heals baldness, he must make a fortune on it, it is a discovery for the millennium
So you think tsuji works on hair cloning every day since 2011 or 2012? I know he probably doesn’t work on hair cloning every day like he should be, that’s why it has taken so god damn long! These researchers I bet you work on it a little every year not every day. If these researchers worked so hard like they work so hard for coronavirus then we would see hair cloning and many more things in at least clinical trials by now. And say what you want I don’t care, but I’m venting I’m frustrated that this has taken so long and he hasn’t even started trials! And so with stemson and the others! Total BS! I’m losing hope! These updates don’t really make me happy I want to see a picture of a human head with transplanted cloned hair! lets go start the trial you have had years of research! No excuses! you guys here in the comments can call me niave or whatever I don’t care I’m upset! And you can say “well they still have to get over the technical problems” they’ve literally had years to do that! No excuses! I want my hair back! sorry Follicle Thought for my rant I’m just very upset I might not even continue to comment on here I don’t want to annoy anyone.
I can see that the admin is biased, my posts in this tone would be deleted long ago
now a few words to you woofy, I know you are young and it pisses you off that your youth is running out and you are going bald, but if you care so much about your hair, start the research yourself and introduce the drug for 50 / K $ in 2 years, they are more important matters in this world than hair
Jan, first off I don’t appreciate your comment. I have to deal with hundreds of comments from people who to some degree or another are faced with a difficulty from hair loss and I moderate them fine. In the past you repeatedly posted negative comments which don’t benefit others who read them. Feel free to reference my advice to Woofy in the previous post.
Admin the truth is that no one knows when hair cloning will be available for people
ps. What with organ technologies site? does anyone know something?
Hey Woofy, I understand you’re upset bud, but it’s important to realize that complaining does not support the cause that you’re looking for. I also understand that people who aren’t multi-millionaires sometimes feel helpless in the cause of actualizing new hair treatments. My advice is try to find one way to be supportive to the cause, whether Spiritually or otherwise. If not, it’s likely best to accept or detach from the situation. By all means, you can connect with other readers here, ask questions and find constructive ways to navigate the challenges, but, this is not meant to be a venting board. Thanks for understanding.
Admin, when do you think the earliest date that it would be released?
Thank you
Maybe late 2023 at earliest.
Follicle Thought, what are you guys talking about? What do you think is going to release in january? 🙂
Oh, that was wrong thread on my part. I fixed my response.
Admin what do You think about uk hair clone company, will they deliver something in the near future/.?
Simply stay bald! All the treats cause libido loss, loss of sperm…
Hey admin, Do you think pyrilutamide will be released before Breezula? When is the earliest we will see either of these products out in the market?
Hi Hope, my opinion is that Breezula will be released first because it only needs 1 more trial before marketing. Estimation of release is around Q4 2022 or early 2023.
I appreciate your opinion. Thanks!!
There is no reason why kintor should not have released phase 2 efficacy and safety data, unless they are trying to hide information.
My expectations in this therapy are low and for good reasons
do you think thy are still going to release the data in the next month before the 31st? thanks
According to previous statements from Kintor, yes, the phase 2 data is coming by the end of this year.
Respectfully, another anti androgen is meaningless. We’ve had topical anti androgens since the 1970’s and there are at least a dozen or more on the market. If they were helpful they would have helped by now. This is as about as meaningful as Rigley announcing another flavor of gum.
Chris
This is topical as well but they claim first in class phase 3 drug , don’t really get it !!!
I’ll take you all on ?? Yeah guys if DHT were the sole or even primary cause of hair loss men would have stopped losing their hair a long time ago. I and tens of thousands of others have taken oral finasteride with dutastsride and multiple topical anti androgens (spiro, flutamide, RU, many others) at the same time. Technically, there should be almost no DHT on the scalp but I’ve seen zero reduction in hair loss and that’s usually the story for most people. I’ve been following this for 20 years online. The real cause of hair loss is genetics. They’re programmed with a certain number of cycles then that’s it. You are all going to be very disappointed when cloning comes and hair loss continues because both the genetics and the microenvironment i.e. the surrounding skin will have to be reprogrammed for hair loss to be stopped.
Chris, I respect your situation, however there are literally more than a hundred million people who have used finasteride or anti-androgen product X and have successfully slowed down hair loss and/or reversed some hair loss, even if the efficacy waned over time. It’s non-debatable. Are other factors involved in hair cycling? Sure. But, if anti-androgens didn’t work then millions of men would have not noticed regrowth after taking finasteride.
We haven’t had one with pyrilutamide’s potency
Chris, with all due respect, what are you expecting? These are the way to fight hair loss, it is to say countering the action of DHT, stimulating the grown of the hair and so on. Basically what we already have with Minoxidil and finasteride. Now the point is finding the best way to do it with the minimum possible sides. This is basically what all these researches are about. Plus, it is better to enlarge the range of options, so that who can’t or don’t want to take finasteride has alternatives. It’s always something that requires life-long commitment and doesn’t necessarily work for everyone in the same way.
The only true possible alternative to all this would be hair cloning but god only knows when such a thing will be available, now they even say 2025…sounds very optimistic to me but who knows. All this leaving out all the issue with costs and else…
@John Rapaport complete results are expected to be released within the next few days, weeks at most, they have been consistent with their own timelines so far.
I don’t think they would keep on sponsoring their research so out loud if the results were that bad, it’s a matter of prestige and credibility of the brand, above all so young a brand like theirs, it’s not L’Oreal or Pfizer that can afford big setbacks as if nothing happened.
Plus, consider that they are Chinese and this has many implications: China is very willing to brave the market and defy Western and Japanese supremacy in this sector as well as in many others; not to mention that China is trying to do everything they can to wash their image worldwide after COVID-19, and I’ve read on this same blog and on YouTube people writing stuff like “wow, if this work I’m gonna learn Chinese”, “gosh, if they make I’m reconsidering communism under a different light”, and stuff like this, clearly ironically but not even that much…hair loss is an extremely widespread issue and whoever finds an effective solution is gonna get big revenues in terms of money and personal prestige.
Definitely, I’m keeping my feet on the ground as well, deceptions are always behind the corner, this doesn’t mean that we can’t approach this with a moderate and disillusioned optimism.
Chris—-there is no topical anti androgen with this much research to back up its efficacy. So saying it is meaningless is meaningless. Now, you also say: “if they were helpful they would have helped by now”. So you do not think that something like RU is helpful? Results from it can be quite drastic. Comparing it to a flavor of gum makes no sense to me.
Chris – Yeah, I don’t agree but everyone is entitled to an opinion ?
It would not make any sense for them to start Phase III if Phase II results are not good. The company has a very rich pipeline of drugs – they aren’t a one-trick pony desperate to get some revenue off one hair loss drug. But disappointment is the common denominator in this industry.
I am wondering why it has taken them over 4 1/2 months to start the US Phase II trial – it was greenlighted by the FDA way back in July.
Hey admin what are your thoughts on the ethical issues of Kintor? https://www.bmj.com/content/375/bmj.n2819
Given the topic is widely controversial by default, I don’t put much stock into that article. Additionally, the major concerns appear to be directed at Applied Biology who ran the trial and not Kintor who manufactures the drug.
Fair perspective admin keep up the awesome work
Thank you thank you
Where are the results from phase 2?
Neppers: they are expected to be released within the next few weeks. Before the end of the year.
Yoda come out of retirement and say hello 🙂
https://www.globaltimes.cn/page/202111/1240061.shtml
kintor covid19 result in December ,hope AGA as well
@Kapil, this very likely to happen, what I hope is that the results will live up to the expectations, I’m putting a lot of hopes on this drug!
Everyone should have low expectations for any new drug. I see people getting all excited because they completed phase 2 and starting phase 3. No pics yet and no results. Just wait and see they show. We got all hyped with samumed fast track of trials and look how that ended up. If this kintor drug can grow back norwoods and complete halt hair loss then I’ll be the first in line to buy it. If stops and thickens existing hair I’ll still buy it. We need more options and real legit working options. 23 years with no new fda approved drug for mpb. Sad and pathetic. Msybe just msybe kintor will be the new big guys on the block for us.
Any new updates on Bayer?
Also looking to get an fue on my right side of hair line as it’s getting thinner. Rahal, konior any good for like 1000 grafts max. Just need some filling in.
Mjones ,
With respect to HMI-115, don’t expect anything. The company seems to be more worried about endometriosis. It’s unlikely they will co initiate a trail for prolactin patterned alopecia alongside
Hope had mentioned they raised a round of financing to begin trials in endometreosis and AGA.
I usually don’t comment something like this about a company , but it seems like Hope medicine’s primary aim is endometriosis and they alway mention AGA for the sake of it (hair loss drug draws attention) or for money. But who knows maybe they are really doing something for AGA.
Shayak, I am surprised you have not read the press release from Hope Medicine (it has been one of their most discussed press releases) which states verbatim that the company raised money to begin “multi-center phase 2 clinical trials for androgenic alopecia.” Whatever happens in the future, we shall see, but this is straight from the horse’s mouth that they are in the game for hair trials and not just “thinking about it.” https://www.asiaone.com/business/hope-medicine-completed-us56-million-series-b-financing-strengthening-capabilities-global
@Mjones I’m hopeful but I agree with you on the fact that we must keep our feet on the ground, after all so far we’ve been trusting this company based on their word…
It is true that is a young company with a lot of iron in the fire (a whole pipeline of products!) and they would lose credibility if they claimed to have a miraculous cure and then failed miserably, so this makes me hope for the best, still though…
Let’s see, complete results should be released within the next few weeks ?
Hi is kintor going to be the next promising available treatment in 2023/2024 or do you know of something of anything promising coming to market 2022?
Why people claim Kintor will release pyrilutamide phase II result before the end of the year when in the interim report they state: “Expected to release detailed data of phase II clinical trials for
AGA male adults in China in Q4 2021-Q1 2022? Am I missing something?
Akira, Kintor has discussed multiple timepoints that they planned to release the data by and this has created a bit of confusion. For example, in this press release they even expected to release data by Q3 2021. Also, in this press release they use a run-on sentence which sounds like they possibly meant that data will be released in Q4 2021; see the sentence “Upon finalization…” Now, you’re referencing another time where they mention a different timeline, by the way, what was the date of the press release you referenced?
In any event, Kintor has mentioned a few potential dates for release of their data. I hope people can understand that is the reason why there are multiple opinions on the dates and it has even been confusing for me. I think by now we can surmise that the data will be released “in the near future” and there’s not much to worry about. When we get the data, we will see what pyrilutamide is capable of.
Hi admin,
I have some questions. The first one is, will kintor show us befor and after pics or only statistics and results on paper?
And my second question is, are you in contact with HopeMedicine? Bc the results and pictures are great, that‘s why i wanted to asked them some things so if you ever do an interview with them please let me know.
I don’t know about Kintor, it’s their choice. Not in touch with Hope at the moment.
hope-medicine has pics, where can i see these?
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT05101317
Hi admin,
Is this just a preliminary listing on the clinical trial page? And could you please do an interview with Dr Maksim plikus,the guy has done some phenomenal research on hair. Also a interview with yuva biosciences. LoL probably asked for a lot of things, just wanna get excited about some positive hair loss news , after all this crazy year is going to end.
@Shayak wow, it looks like China seriously wants to storm the hair market!
@Bill its for Endometriosis-Associated Pain ?, they will probably start one for hair loss as well.
Thanks for the suggestions Shayak. For you and others who are enjoying the site please consider making a contribution to my Patreon https://www.patreon.com/FollicleThought It’s always appreciated.
Hi I want to buy laser helmet. the only source I know is Amazon.but wud it be authentic. Laser helmets can be helpful for women.if anyone can guide me please
We are conducting a group buy for Pyrilutamide / KX-826.
We’ve managed to find a lab which would synthesise this for us and it is a reliable lab which we’ve used for previous group buys. We’ve had chemicals tested from this lab before which have all come back at 99% purity but regardless we will also be getting the Pyrilutamide third party tested for purity once it arrives. The way this group buy works is there is no middleman and we each pay the lab directly through alibaba and they handle production and shipping for us.
People who would like to participate in the group buy can join here:
https://discord.gg/hMUWTXSDbu
C’moooon ????
What a wonderful way to start the year with! Home stretch… it’s harder and harder not to get excited lol
Fantastic start to the new year.???
hello, FT, first, thank you so much for your web and happy 2022. I am a woman. Can we expect this treatment to work on women too? just because the trial is conducted on men doesn’t mean we could not benefit, couldn’t we? Do you know if there is any company working specifically on AGA in women?
Hi Rulita, yes this treatment may work for women as Kintor has already begun a phase 2 trial using the drug for women’s approval. If the male labeled drug is approved first, it could be used off-label for women too, pending doctor’s discretion.
Kintor or die.
Good news overall I am interested to see FDA phase1b results than phase2 from China
Excellent news to start the New Year. Thanks for keeping us updated FT, looking forward to seeing those phase 2 results when they come
FT, so this means they’ll conclude their trials in June ? As it says it’ll take 6 months
Adeel, no they aim to finish enrollment in June, which will then take 6 months after that to complete the trial. Patients start as soon as they are enrolled.
But it says the first patient has aldy been dosed, so that means he finishes by June. I don’t get it.
Sorry haha
No problem.
The first patient will complete by June. However, they are still enrolling 416 people and plan that they will fill that number by June. Then those people who signed on in June need 6 months further. ?
oh so I get it, basically June is when they have predicted to get the 416 patients.I promise last question, so if they have the 416 patients say in March, that means it’s six months from March then right ? thank you and I’ll get out of your hair.
No worries Adeel. Yes, whenever they enroll the final patient it will be 6 months from then to complete the study and then a few months later data should be out.
When did they start phase 1? They are making follica look like fools.
Dear admin
Thank u very much indeed.you are very active these holiday.have a good holiday.
Don’t get hyped before we see the phase II results guys, little piece of advice from my personal experience.
@Gilbert Absolutely! Still though, seeing a drug making it to phase III
and, to boot, in a reasonable time, is almost touching!
Now, god only knows how all this will end up, but I feel like saying that something in the field may have changed, as Kintor has showed the world that it is not necessary to wait 3000 years to proceed from one phase to another like Breezula or others!
Will it be good? I really hope so, they sound pretty confident to start multiple studies both in China and the US and I don’t think they want to create false expectations just to risk another backlash after that of the Covid medication that made their stocks plummet.
Will it fail? Then, thanks for trying anyway and above all for doing it in reasonable time.
Fingers crossed!
Arias ?
@Arias their COVID medication from Brazil showed good efficacy whey it comes to FDA not so it reflects on their stock Sorry I am not bringing negative thoughts some point FDA results will be published Good thing I can see on kintor they are not saying we will do phase3 next year or 2025 they are doing it now many companies doing trials over 10 years still promise something next year If Kintor can’t bring something I will be sad as everyone I still believe Kintor will succeed
Honestly 2021 was a pretty good year for hair loss. Kintor speeds through trials, Stemson got great funding and Koehler lab might also develop a hair cloning technology with their hair-bearing skin.
@blave 2021 a good year for hairloss? What have you been smoking?
Samumed flopped, the only hairloss treatment in phase III in the west…
Quiet for the rest of the year. Biggest light was the Bayer study showing prolactin having a big impact in hairloss.
Also admin, any updates from Hairclone? Weren’t the going to start now?
I think by the end of March is a realistic timeline to start thinking about HairClone being close.
I’m surprised they jumped to phase 3 before even releasing phase 2 results. Something sounds awefully shady
Neppers–why shady Neppers? Obviously I’d also like to see the phase 2 results, but I cannot think of a reason why the results would be bad. They wouldn’t go through the whole effort to produce a phase 3 trial otherwise. This time they enrolled way more patients, so they also have to spent way more money. It makes absolutely no sense to continue all this if they did not have faith in the outcome. Also, many scientists from many universities in China have seen the phase 2 data and decided to join in on the phase 3 trial. Yes, I’d love to see the phase 2 data, but there is lots to be excited about!
Its all mixed emotions till we actually see it ourselves.The mind sometimes speaks neppers n other times josh
Phase 3 isn’t something we see everyday, and I’m happy for that.
But why is it taking so long to release phase 2 data? ? I don’t want to bring negativity, seriously, but they should publish them now tbh…
Question to Everyone and Admin.
Can this cure a Norwood 7 bald guy. Or is it to maintain existing hair like Minoxidil or Finasteride. If its the second one thats pretty good for others and im happy fpr everyone who can bendfit from it. In my case it would bring nothing. So please tell me if anyone knows. Thank you very much
@Mm Sadly this product (provided that it works) will likely keep the existing hair and nothing more, maybe it will allow some regain, better if in combination with Minoxidil perhaps, but I don’t think it will be able to do much for advanced baldness, if the follicle is fully dead there’s nothing to do except hair transplant (with all its physical limits) and someday, maybe, hair cloning…
Are you sure? What is giving you the conclusion for your opinion?
Thank you very much for your opinion
@admin, what are your thoughts on follica? The more I learn about hairloss, the more it seems like the most viable treatment for NW <= 4, given that it already resembles dependable mechanisms like Minox + microneedling (and the 44% figure is basically what minox + microneedling yields on average.)
also, what are your thoughts on fibrosis and calcification as the hard limits on hair regrowth?
as always, appreciate the work you do, it's a beacon of hope for us.
Follica essentially is microneedling plus minoxidil at this stage. Also, they have been stuck at pre-phase 3 for about 2 years now with no explanation about why they are delaying. That’s basically what I would say about them. As for fibrosis and calcification, I don’t have a useful opinion to share at the moment.
Follica is a joke. They have been in trials for more than 10 years for there micro needling device and George Cotsarelis has a history of making false promises.
Yeah if follica had something they would have released it. Plus I am starting to doubt the microneedling thing. I tried it for 6 months and my hair is much worse, especially the hair line. It gave me shock loss and I wasn’t even going hard. Just light redness with no bleeding. I used rogaine the day after. I stopped and hoping my density and hairline will grow back…
Mjones, Did you use a Derma Roller or a DermaPen? If you used a DermaPen, which type and brand did you use?
And how often did you microneedle?
Derma stamp, 1mm once a week.
Have you been sterilizing your Derma stamp properly before each use?
Also, you may want to try decreasing the frequency of use of needling to once every 2 weeks or even better, once a month. Reason being is because there’s a lot of growth factors and good stuff that happens right until 1 month, and often times people don’t realize that everyone is different so we can’t all be needling at a frequency of once a week. Some peoples body needs a longer time to heal, especially with consistent wounding. You might end up creating a never evending cycle of inflammation and allowing for very little and possibly not complete healing of the micro wounds before you start needling again.
I have a nice picture showing very important healing mechanisms that take place right up until one month post needling. For that reason often once a month can be many people’s ideal needling frequency.
Also, you may want to consider using a DermaPen type Microneedling Device because it is more accurate and causes less micro-tears. The Derminator 2 is the best, second best is the Dr Pen M8.
Those micro-tears might be a reason for increased inflammation and possibly worsening of hair.
Also Kintor’s covid treatment failed phase III.
Follica is a joke, reminds me of Histogen. The biggest joke in this industry.
Peterson, Kintor didn’t exactly fail their Phase 3 trial for Covid based on the efficacy of the drug. They have to redo their Phase 3 trial because a conclusive result could not be obtained due to a very low amount of trial participants being hospitalized, therefore they could not make a proper analysis.
However, it is disappointing that Kintor has to repeat this trial and should not be taken lightly because they can’t want to be considered a “reputable” company in the research field and making mistakes like poorly screening the participants of the study (they accepted participants which had a higher probability of recovery by selecting younger healthier people). Big investors were not fooled by this and that can be seen by the stock price of Kintors dropping by 80%.
I want Kintors treatments for Hairloss to work as much as every optimistic person here, but I think we should all be very cautious about Kintor moving forward.
I also don’t see how a company can claim no side effects, but not show exactly how that is possible. Right now all we have as an explanation from them is “Trust me bro”.
We’ve seen how Merck and FDA claimed no severe sides on Propecia, but later Finasteride turned out to be the most controversial hairloss drug based on its side effect profile.
I trust hearing personal reviews from real people who have tried a treatment far more than these “reputable studies” because data manipulation is real.
Therefore, even when Pyrilutamide is released, I will Wait atleast a year to hear the reviews from at least a few hundred to a thousand real people before deciding whether it truly is side effect free or not.
If Kintor have something to show for AGA their stock will rebound normally any company goes to phase3 is enough to boost their stock but this time…….
Josh, I’m optimistic about Kintor but I can’t trust the science of any hairloss company unless I see proof of atleast the trials results.
Regarding the side effects of Finasteride, I’ve never heard of someone saying their anus turned numb, but they are definitely a set of consistent sexual and mental side effects that repeatedly come up thousands of times, which everyone is aware of.
Anyway, I’m not going to get into a discussion about the side effects of Finasteride as most people already know about it.
I am however looking forward to seeing when HairClone starts their treatment this year and seeing what the results are on that.
Sonic—sure let’s not talk about finasteride sides if you don’t want (although I do feel there’s a lot of unfair fear mongering regarding this drug).
I agree that we have to wait for results obviously.
I can see how you are looking forward to that. Hair cloning would be amazing. Obviously, I would prefer (and I think all people) to be fully drug free.
Sonic—-I agree with you about being cautious with kintor. On the other hand, I disagree with your other claims. You should just trust the science much more than random people online. You can find people claiming they have side effects from fluridil even. Perhaps You could wait for other researchers to test out pyrilutamide if you do not trust kintor themselves. Of course, the FDA will also still look at Kintor’a efficacy and safety profile. Moreover, you also do not know why exactly people have the side effects they do. You mentioned finasteride, some people claim it caused them to have a numb anus. I mean really? We do not know what other medication people online use; how psychologically healthy they are, how fat, etc. If anything is “just trust me bro”, it would be random people claiming all kinds of things online. Tons of people also claim they got magnetic from the Covid vaccine. Should we trust them more than the science?
You’re right, especially your comment about finasteride. Sadly many in the hairloss community still don’t understand the dangers of finasteride.
Hi follicle thought,
I remember Dr Kemp said in an interview a few months ago that Hairclone would be available in the UK “early 2022”.
We haven’t heard from them since, do you still think they are on track for launching in early 2022 or it would be delayed to about the end of 2022?
I would say give them to around end of March Jade. We’re only 8 days into 2022.
folks, I appreciate the feedback on my earlier comment. what treatmens are looking most hopeful at this point?
Hi merk,
I am personally looking forward to Hairclone and in general companies that focus on stem cell therapies like HanBio, that focus on injecting cells into thinning areas in order to hopefully stop the hair loss from progressing any further.
The only issue I see with this is that there is research that suggests stem cell therapies can cause tumors in some cases. That’s why stem cell therapies are not approced by the FDA yet.
But I hope they will resolve this problem in the future.
Something for keep going Still it’s old news
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@Admin have you heard that Harvard University was researching Hairloss.
“Under both normal and stress conditions, adding Gas6 was sufficient to activate hair follicle stem cells that were in the resting phase and to promote hair growth,” Choi said. “In the future, the Gas6 pathway could be exploited for its potential in activating stem cells to promote hair growth. It will also be very interesting to explore if other stress-related tissue changes are related to the stress hormone’s impact on regulating Gas6.”
https://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2021/03/researchers-discover-how-chronic-stress-leads-to-hair-loss/
I’ve read about the study, but it seems to be a very primitive/potentially irrelevant theory as far as a potential therapeutic target. I would not be surprised if we never heard about this mechanism again.
That’s true, similar to anything David Sinclair claims to hear about Hairloss, we probably will never see anything materialize from the research.
Yet David Sinclair has an active research project going on with a lab in Harvard that is a world leader in hair follicle “cloning” – the two examples, Sinclair and Gas6, are distinct in my opinion. David Sinclair is a commercialization type of scientist, money is thrown at him. The Gas6 researchers are more akin to be just “putting out a research paper”, in my opinion.
So most likely a 2-3 year wait until it is fully available and gt20029 probably looking at 5+ years, and here we thought we were almost at the finish line for 1st kintor treatment, we’ll struggle on 💪
[…] For all the details on the trial, head to the Articles page to read the updated Kintor Phase 3 article which is currently stickied to the top of the […]
This is rough news. Obviously needs to be safe, but thought we were almost at the finish line for the first Kintor treatments. Typical L for this community, I suppose.
Ah ffs! But technically speaking it is more assuring like for example I was waiting for Cosmerna for so long but bcz it’s not FDA approved am waiting for at least another 6 months to see results and if any sides reported. If this take another year of testing to be approved by china or Us FDA then once released you can use with minimal hesitation or more assurance. And maybe US wont require the additional 52 weeks. Good and bad news I guess.
Hello
I see that you regularly post about hair regeneration progress, thank you very much for that. When do you personally believe hair cloning will become available for humans?
It’s very difficult to guess. 10 years seems like a reasonable guess. It’s possible to come sooner or take longer than that.
FT have you read this article ? https://news.rpi.edu/content/2023/11/15/scientists-3d-print-hair-follicles-lab-grown-skin Any thoughts on this? This seems to be mind blowing
Vishal, I have heard about this, but I’ve actually been working on a few stories of more compelling hair cloning research. This is great research, however, at the moment I feel that it’s very far from clinical application. It seems as though Christiano and Jahoda achieved this type of research years ago and did not gain much traction afterward.
I had a feeling that Pyrilutamide wouldn’t be as amazing as advertised. Especially at this point since 1993, big interventions are needed for drastic improvement of hair, dermal papilla multiplication, hair cloning, Amplifica, GT20029 etc
Where is the link that kintor sent this out? I don’t see any press release or link from them there is nothing on there news page on their website at all about kx-826 phase 3 results…
Andy, the press release is listed under the Announcements and Circulars section. https://en.kintor.com.cn/Announcements.html
https://www.cureus.com/articles/209405-topically-applied-magnetized-saline-water-activates-autophagy-in-the-scalp-and-increases-hair-count-and-hair-mass-index-in-men-with-mild-to-moderate-androgenetic-alopecia#!/
Any news coming soon on Pelage or Veradermics? Hopefully we end the year with some positive news after that kintor announcement.
Thanks for sharing Andy. I think you must have read my comments about Pelage recently, and Veradermics has said they will do an interview with Follicle Thought in Q2 2024, the timing has been pushed back.
Hopefully they will have some good news to share as around then they should be finished their phase 2 trial they have recently started. Look forward to your updates and let’s hope 2024 is an exciting year.
Andy what are your thoughts for 2026-2027? You thinking we could get Epibiotech, Yokohama, or Amplifica into the market?
I’m not a scientist or a chemist, but I did some research on pyrilotamide.
The chemical structure of pyrilutamide is very similar to enzalutamide. The dose of enzalutamide for prostate cancer is 160 mg. If I want to use enzalutamide topically for hair loss, I start by trial and error with a concentration of 2% (equivalent to 20 mg). Due to the high similarity between pyrilutamide and enzalutamide, their doses should be close to each other. That is, I use pyrilutamide with a concentration of 2%.
I think the problem with pyrilutamide is just the dosage. Pyrilotamide doesn’t work at a concentration of 0.5%.
@admin any thoughts on koshine? Which is pyrilutamide being sold as a cosmetic by kintor.
Seems like they are taking orders worlwide aswell.